question 31 replies, 56280 views

Gatsby
12/17/2010 10:15:00 PM
My kids go to a Christian day school. They get taught about Christianity on a daily basis here and there, but during the Holidays they learn all about the real meaning of Christmas.

The kids made angels out of toilet paper rolls the other day which are proudly displayed on the wall in the one hallway of the school. Each angel has the picture of the child who made is as the face.

Well, this evening when I picked Dax up from school he told me that his friend's Daddy saw the angel on the wall that belonged to his friend and he ripped it down and told his son that they didn't believe in God and that if he sees him doing something God related again he was going to spank him.

I was talking to a teacher (who is my bff) and she told me that the kids father is Muslim (his wife is not). He was also just in the hospital for mental issues.

For some reason this sits really bad with me. I know I am stereotyping, but I don't know this man. He obviously has problems and it scares me that being a father of one of the kids, can come in the school at any time. Why a christian school? When you sign the paperwork when they are enrolled you acknowledge they are going to be taught about a christian god.

I almost don't even want my kids at the school anymore. Is this wrong of me? How would you feel?
Bashar al-Acab
12/17/2010 10:18:00 PM
question, tell me waht you think about me
i buy my own diamonds and i buy my own rings
crunkmoose
12/17/2010 10:19:00 PM
I'd be more worried about the christian nature of the school than the muslim guy.

Also... please tell me your kid is named after Dax Riggs.

Dan.
12/17/2010 10:21:00 PM
I went to catholic school for awhile growing up and we had a family of atheists that attended the school. It was kind of weird but they were all smart and did well in the theology classes. The parents liked the school and discipline that came with it and didn't mind at all about the religious aspect of it.

And there are crazy people everywhere, there is no escaping that.
Gatsby
12/17/2010 10:26:00 PM
Originally posted by: crunkmoose

I'd be more worried about the christian nature of the school than the muslim guy.

Also... please tell me your kid is named after Dax Riggs.


yes, that's who he was names after.

The school is the best in the area - They don't preach, they just teach the basics, that's the least of my concerns.
Pollcat
12/17/2010 10:33:00 PM
Originally posted by: crunkmoose

I'd be more worried about the christian nature of the school than the muslim guy.

Of course you would.

I wouldn't pull my kids out of the school but I would mention something to the teachers. No care that he is a Muslim there is no need for a father to be ripping something of the wall.
Bashar al-Acab
12/17/2010 10:37:00 PM
the terrorists have won
Gatsby
12/17/2010 10:38:00 PM
Originally posted by: Pollcat

Originally posted by: crunkmoose

I'd be more worried about the christian nature of the school than the muslim guy.

Of course you would.

I wouldn't pull my kids out of the school but I would mention something to the teachers. No care that he is a Muslim there is no need for a father to be ripping something of the wall.

Daxy asked me what would happen if he ripped his angel off the wall (meaning Dax's) that broke my heart
Gatsby
12/17/2010 10:41:00 PM
My concern is his religion and his mental instability. It makes me feel very nervous about him. I feel like I'm falling into serious stereotyping, but I can't help it. It makes me feel really uneasy about the whole thing.
carlos danger
12/17/2010 10:58:00 PM
You should have mentioned to him that the Articles of Faith in Islam require him to believe in angels (Mohammad says so), and that the Muslim angels of Jibraaiyl, Israafiyl, Azraaiyl are really just Gabriel, Raphael, and Azrael from Christian mysticism--indeed all the angels which Muslims are required to believe were *ahem* part of Christian tradition first. Even though Christians (and by extension Muslims) stole their celestial beings from Judaism a Muslim will never admit to stealing from a Jew so you win the argument as long as no one knows about Zoroastrianism.

If he claims that it is against his beliefs to show depictions of angels show him this 700-year-old picture from the Jami al-Tawarikh of Mohammad being visited by the angel Gabriel:


If he claims it he's just offended by his son's face on an angel's body (since according to mysticism angels are soulless, mindless drones who lack free will and conscience and exist only as playthings for God) just stamp his forehead with a fingertip's worth of your menstrual blood. he will have to undergo a cleansing ritual which will have him out for your hair for a couple of weeks.
Bashar al-Acab
12/17/2010 11:03:00 PM
white people
brian.
12/17/2010 11:07:00 PM
Dianana
12/17/2010 11:09:00 PM
I think they should make stricter rules about anyone entering the school. But don't take your kids out, say something to the people who run it.
Sounds like that guy hates fun and sucks all around. It's pretty stupid to scream at your child, in their school no less, that you're going to spank them.
Gatsby
12/18/2010 12:24:00 AM
The school requires a fingerprint scan to get in. Buy since it's his father he has access. I'm just worried this guy will come back and try to do something stupid because his son is being taught about Christianity (in a Christian school-go figure)
Bonsai
12/18/2010 3:55:00 AM
If Dax saw this incident, I'm sure a teacher witnessed it as well. If she was concerned, wouldn't she have done something? Is it possible that what seemed scary to Dax wouldn't have been such a big deal to an adult who witnessed the same?

Why is this teacher friend feeding into your fears? Is she personally concerned about her safety or the safety of her students around this man? If so, why hasn't the hell hasn't SHE done something about it? And how much does she really know about his mental health problems? Where did that info come from? Teachers always seem to talk a lot, but their information isn't always accurate.

I don't know, it seems like you're just being paranoid because he is Muslim. Would you be as upset if he was a white atheist or an Asian, or whatever else? It would probably still be a bit disconcerting, but would you be considering pulling your kids from the best school available to you over it?

We had a fair number of Jewish kids, a Lutheran family, and an atheist family in my Catholic elementary school. Some parents requested alternate assignments for their kids once in a while (which a few teachers denied,) and some parents excluded their kids from certain faith-focused field trips or pulled them out early on Mass days, but just as many kids did the work, tagged along for the experience or simply stayed in their pew during the sacraments. For the most part, parents knew what to expect and were okay with the brainwashing their kids were exposed to. But if a faith-based school openly welcomes mixed faith families, I think there probably should be a bit more respect and leeway given to those who don't share the faith. It's a hard choice to make--do you provide your kids with the best possible education, knowing that beliefs and ideas that contradict your own will be imposed on them, or do you sacrifice the quality of their education for a religion-free school? It's an easier decision when your beliefs are closely aligned with those being taught, but for anyone else it can be a source of turmoil. This guy probably weighed the decision for a long while, and had his wife pulling in one direction while his family and conscience pulled in another. Then to see his son seemingly adopting those very beliefs he was so worried about exposing him to? That would anger a lot of people who place an extremely high importance on their beliefs. But it doesn't sound like his anger was directed at the school or teachers or the other students, so I don't really see why you are so worried.

Point of reference: My dad was raised in a German Protestant church (the boys in his family were Protestant and the girls were raised Roman Catholic, no idea why.) My brother and I were raised Catholic and went to a Catholic school, and there were several times that my dad snapped over things we were being taught--usually ideas we came home with about Catholicism being the "one true religion." I once innocently repeated something to him that we were told in second grade about not getting into heaven if you don't do the whole Sign of the Cross bit. Pretty sure the nun was just trying to encourage compliance and shut someone up by using shitty scare tactics, but whatever. I sat across from him while we said grace before dinner, and then I started on him about not crossing himself. He raged, I went to bed crying and with a red hand print across my face, and he walked across the street to the convent 30 minutes later and chewed out the second grade nun.

There is a strong family history of anxiety and depression and my dad is not exempt from either. He and my mom were both proponents of corporal punishment, and at times my dad got a little more upset with us than was situationally appropriate--particularly when he felt disrespected, but I wouldn't say he was quick tempered or anything. He never hit my mom, never got into fights (he was the guy breaking them up) and never really did anything that would give people cause for concern. He would never hurt anyone, and anyone who knows him will say he is the nicest, sweetest guy they know. However, had someone seen that one incident and not known much else about him, they may have had other ideas. Y'know, Reggie drinks, he's got a temper, he's a little unstable--I heard he's on some kind of meds, he's yelling at this poor nun, he owns a couple of guns, yadda yadda. But dude has never been a risk to anyone, except perhaps himself. He just took it very personally when his kids came home and said that their teacher told them their dad was going to hell. lol.

This Muslim guy didn't even flip out on a teacher. He didn't make threats (aside from laying out a clear consequence for his son,) he didn't rip another student's angel off the wall, he didn't beat his kid in the middle of the hallway... he just took down his own son's project and spoke to his son about it. Yeah, he should muffled his anger, should have been less conspicuous about removing the angel and should have waited until he got home or to the car to say anything to his kid about it. But it really doesn't sound like anything I would be overly concerned about based solely on that one incident.

Also, not sure if it has extended to private schools yet, but in the public schools up here, you need to pass an FBI background check to step foot in the school or be at all involved in the PTA or anything. You can't even donate cookies for a bake sale without a background check, and you can't get into the building to drop off your kid's forgotten lunch bag or missing homework unless you have the FBI clearance and a visitor's pass from security. If your school has gotten as far as employing fingerprint recognition technology, I'm sure they are a school that takes anything they deem a risk very seriously. If school employees knew this guy was mentally unstable, they could have his clearance reviewed/revoked. He's been in the school, the teachers know him, and he is still allowed back; parent or not, if he was a risk, I don't think he would be there.

Anyway, if you are still rattled after sleeping on it, I'd go speak to the principal or head of security... maybe both. Discuss your concerns, get some peace of mind, and let your kids continue to get the best education available to them.

/absurdly long wall-o-bonsai. I even tried to shorten it. Fail.
Gatsby
12/18/2010 11:01:00 AM
oh my lord girl I couldn't read that whole thing.

Dax didn't see it happen, his friend told him what happened when he came in the class because Dax saw he was upset. I'm not sure if any of the teachers know about it yet, other than the one who I told. She's not feeding into my fears, she only told me he was Muslim when I asked her if they were Jewish (the kids have really Jewish sounding names). She didn't know why he was in the hospital other than "mental health issues" but that it was over the summer.

From what I understand he didn't just remove it from the wall and say "don't make these any more" he grabbed it off the wall and threw it on the ground told his son they don't believe in God then threatened to spank him if he continued to make stuff about God.

He very well may have gone to the director afterward and said something to her, but I don't know if he did or not. I've never met the man, they never come to birthday parties and I've never seen him drop them off or pick them up at school before, so something tells me he doesn't usually come in.

I understand that your Dad may be perfectly fine citizen even after mental health issues, but who's to say this guy is the same way? I don't know this person. I don't know his anger issues, what he's capable of doing and what he's like at home. Like I said before, he's not around much which makes me a little more anxious over the whole thing.

And do I think I would be acting like this if it was a white guy? I'm not sure. I wasn't put in to this situation with a white guy. I very well may feel the same way or I could be stereotyping as well. Either way this is how it played out and this is how I feel. I'm still uneasy about the whole thing. I'm going to see the director today, so I might say something to her, or I might wait until Monday. I'm not sure yet.
Davey.
12/18/2010 11:06:00 AM
so this is a story that has been told to you by your child, and was told to him by another child who witnessed the incident?
i would guess that approximately 0% of the facts are correct.

even if it was true and the father did say he doesnt want his son to do anything remotely religious, it doesnt affect your son in any way whatsoever. i dont understand how you think this affects you at all.
the fact that he is muslim is completely irrelevant.
Gatsby
12/18/2010 11:30:00 AM
Originally posted by: Davey.

so this is a story that has been told to you by your child, and was told to him by another child who witnessed the incident?
i would guess that approximately 0% of the facts are correct.

even if it was true and the father did say he doesnt want his son to do anything remotely religious, it doesnt affect your son in any way whatsoever. i dont understand how you think this affects you at all.
the fact that he is muslim is completely irrelevant.

no, the kid who it happened to told him. Because he's 5 I shouldn't believe anything he says? He goes to a Christian School. Why, if they are Muslim, and are going to be upset if they are taught about Christianity in a Christian School would they enroll them there? Especially if he's going to have a hissy fit over it like this? What would affect my son is if this guy freaking snaps because he's pissed that they keep teaching his son about Christianity. That would affect me and my son.

Am I overreacting? Possibly. But I can't help it.
Davey.
12/18/2010 11:35:00 AM
yes, you are completely overreacting. so what if that man is a bad dad with a short temper. or hates christianity. even if he punched the kid in the face every night at bedtime, it wouldnt affect your son.
forget about it.
brian.
12/18/2010 11:40:00 AM
Originally posted by: posterbored

as a parent i would be concerned.

as a non-parent i didnt read any of these walls of text
slutpunch
12/18/2010 11:40:00 AM
regis is my only god

crunkmoose
12/18/2010 11:53:00 AM
Originally posted by: putslunch

Dax is my only god


Gatsby
12/18/2010 12:00:00 PM
Originally posted by: Davey.

yes, you are completely overreacting. so what if that man is a bad dad with a short temper. or hates christianity. even if he punched the kid in the face every night at bedtime, it wouldnt affect your son.
forget about it.

Welp, my fear is that he's going to get pissed off to the point that he'll come to the school and put the kids in danger. I'm over protective, oh well.
Gatsby
12/18/2010 12:01:00 PM
Originally posted by: crunkmoose

Originally posted by: putslunch

Dax is my only god



Kevlar Moneyclips
12/18/2010 1:32:00 PM
its a very wierd situation and people want to gloss over it because observing that muslims flipping out about religion have a tendency to strap dynamite to their chests is racist. but it is what it is- weird dude making a weird scene- he went to restaurant, ordered chicken soup, and then threw the bowl at the wall screaming "I hate chicken soup!"

the likelihood of him endangering your child is almost certainly slim to none though, i would say- pulling your kids and putting them in some other school is just going to expose them to different weirdos with different weirdo parents in different settings
Gatsby
12/18/2010 3:50:00 PM
Yeah I think that pulling them out would be completely overreacting. The school is aware of it and it working to fix the problem which I like.

I can't help that it makes me nervous. I realize that I'm being completely stereotypical about it, but in the same respect that I'm so comfortable with the idea of that school being a safe place for them to be that the smallest little ripple is making me worry.